Survival Server Proposal

[pusur44017]

Since no land claims, I suggest removing economy.

What part of this makes you think I want to keep/tweak economy? Me and butler are discussing the same things, trying to get to a common ground, but now it seems absolutely NOTHING of what I thought I was doing, I am, so do you even read everything properly? I cannot understand how you reach some of the things you said here and I feel there is no use in posting here because a) I can't express myself in ANY way or b) you don't read properly what I write.

For me the poll does not reflect our different options well enough.

-pusur

[bren4q]

do you even read everything properly?

Your posts are not very clear and they sometimes contradict themselves.

On page 1, you say there is no point removing money.

perhaps a way to level this out is to not have any admin shops. That way all economy is based on the players. Removing the money is no point because you will just trade with items instead

On page 2, where you list your points for "To be clear this is my idea:" you don't mention removing economy.

On page 3, where you list your points for "My idea:" you don't mention removing economy.

Later on page 3, you say that chest locks will still cost money and reduce mob rewards, which means keeping an economy:

-Chest locking could cost a symbolic sum, perhaps 1$.
-I really think we should remove all forms of adminshops. I remember having under 400$ and it being quite a lot on the PvE server
-Remove mob rewards or reduce heavily, given that we "nerf economy".

I admit I started skipping through the posts after that more quickly because I thought they would be repeating themselves, so I missed that one line where you changed your mind and said to remove the economy.
Anyway, that's a few more in favour of removing the economy.

Correct me if I'm wrong pusur, the main part of your idea for the server is big team/group builds and projects, is that correct?
That sounds like a perfectly fine idea to me, but I didn't include it in my summary because I don't think it can be controlled by the server. People will decide themselves if they want to do this or not. Its an idea for the community and how people play the game, but the server setup can't control this. Disallowing griefing and PVP will make it a lot easier and safer for people to work together, and most people agree this should be done.

If you want to encourage group building more, how do you propose to do this? If you plan on rewarding people (more land, titles, ranks, etc) then it gets very tricky in group builds. What if one person is lazy and does very little work? Should they get equally rewarded? How can you tell if someone worked hard or not? Its hard.

1. If there are no rewards for group builds => no server change needed, people organise themselves
2. If there are rewards for group builds => a lot more detail is needed on *how* this is managed in order to accept the idea

Anyways, you had asked me for my input, so that was my attempt to understand everything that had been posted and to try find a common ground. Sorry if I took up some parts wrong. Whatever you guys decide on will have no impact on me. I don't mean to rustle any jimmies by commenting.

[pusur44017]

This is a discussion there has to be developments and change of minds that is why they are contradictory. I am trying to develop something everybody can live with and think is fun. I get that posts become confusing because I fail to provide what their content is intended to address. In some posts, I don't mention the details like economy because I want feedback on whether or not people like this general idea.

Trading with money or trading with items is the same, and trading will not stop regardless. Which is why I said there is no point in removing the plugins which provide money management, but admin shops are the ruining factor. Perhaps there will still be ways economy will be ruining. So for me, you might as well remove it. Admin shops I want to have removed regardless.

My idea is that upon starting this, we first make a discussion with the members intending to play survival, making our goals. Then we open the survival server. Everyone who participated in the discussion and stating their intent to play with us has to do so until we reach the goals. There are no rewards for building, but as you are part of the group, you have committed to the goals and should see them through. It's just like any normal group, but with more challenge because you have to build a large, great build on survival.

-There is no way to control who does what, so there will be players who do more and players who do less. But the thing is that our skills are diversified. I have no trouble mining resources or working towards acquiring something, but put me in charge of making a design, and you're in for a crappy build.

I have no idea if this is something people want because we are discussing the details too much. I want to know if this is something a large enough number of people would commit to.

I did not say "you" as in "Bren", I said "you" as in all of you who read this. It's vital that everyone understands that this is a discussion and therefore there will be going back and fourth over minute details that seem like it's repeating itself. Therefore, read as closely as you can, if you don't understand something, ask. Bren, you still provide very useful insight and advice, but when I express something, and then I see that people think I stand for the opposite of what I expressed or someone makes other concerns about my idea that I already addressed, then I need to find out what is going on.

So please tell me, if you (those who read this post) would, given that we can find common ground in our discussion, likely commit to this general idea. If not, please tell me that as well.

-pusur

[sifitis]

I'' throw in my two cents:

No map reset- we worked hard on what we have and there is no real point to scrapping it.

Vanilla orientation- if we want something more exotic, perhaps that can be worked out on a separate server.

Economy is a more complicated issue.  Frankly, I haven't seen any of the alleged "drama" people keep talking about.  Nobody is fighting over money, so I see no real reason to nuke it.  If we decide to, though, I won't be devastated.  I suggest some form of compensation for those who would be losing $20,000 or more- again, we worked hard for it.

[bren4q]

@sifitis
Is your suggestion then, no change whatsoever?

What does "Vanilla orientation" mean in terms of changes, if any?

[sifitis]

Personally, I'm fine with it staying the way it is, but I don't have any problems with a PVE focus if we decide to change.  I don't like the idea of a plugin or mod driven game.  I'd prefer to keep it as vanilla as possible, with a few plugins in place to keep things running (LWC for example).

[Krawkyz]

I would highly suggest anyone who wants to put in their thoughts to the general type of server to please vote on the poll. I will close it tomorrow and disclose the results.

NOTE: The poll is not to show every option, merely to boil it down so we stop talking about moot issues.

[Krawkyz]

it seems the majority want a vanilla-oriented server (6 to 3)

Updated poll for more specific decisions.

[Jahona]

So for starters I have turned off PVP on the server for the time being.  I've removed any mention of raiding and and pvp from the auto message.  Kraw I'm going to need to redo the book you get at spawn.  I've also installed dynamap so that I can fully see what we have going on with the world.  It's rendering now and might take a while to finish.

Second, to just get feed back on changes.  It seems that overall most people are in favor of loosing the economy.  Personally I don't have a problem with that.  It was just an addition at the time to give people more to do.  On the original survival server it was primarily PVE with a few PVP arenas.  I should be able to set this up with WorldGuard.  On a previous iteration we experimented with the idea of protected vs wild zones, granted that was also rank based. 

So my question is would you prefer arenas or anarchy regions?

[Skitty]

darkzones

[Thrash393]

Sounds great Darth. The PvP areas should be the next poll (poke kraw). If we are removing the economy does that mean no money and only trading for diamonds? Or reset to zero and only acquire money from selling goods to players? Also on with this idea, we should sell the trading stalls at spawn to players for 5k maybe 1 per person to fill in those new blank spaces.

[Jahona]

darkzones

Well maybe.  Those haven't really worked out well for Ubisoft.

[Krawkyz]

Bumping:

PvE seems to be the vote. (6 to 3)
Any Further Suggestions can be commented here to vote over.

For now, I suggest a total rule change of Survival to a PvE-oriented environment (i.e. griefing banned, PvP not allowed). The server, vanilla-oriented, should have as few plugins as necessary. Henceforth, I suggest we remove the economy system entirely, remove HorseCraftables (you can get that stuff from Villagers!), remove ProtectionStones and introduce GriefPrevention.

If Darth gives me the tellraw for the current Survival Rulebook, I can rewrite it [or he can rewrite it, doesn't matter].

[pusur44017]

Perhaps if the goal is to not create so much of an economy it would be best to keep HorseCraftables?

-pusur

[Krawkyz]

Perhaps if the goal is to not create so much of an economy it would be best to keep HorseCraftables?

-pusur

Considering you can get all of these items (except horse armor) without scavenging dungeons:
Saddles can be found fishing; they are sold by Leatherworker Villagers
Nametags can be found fishing; they are sold by Cleric Villagers

If you are worried about HorseCraftables, then just remove the ability to get Saddles and Nametags from them. Horse armor being craftable is an alright addition to vanilla.